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Thread: Confused about mixed feelings about music career

  1. #16
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    you ever see some of those psychology tests where the test subject keeps trying to jam a triangle shape in a round hole ?

    it doesn't work, no matter how hard you want it too,

    that the impression I get from SOME of You members here that have replied to her thread,

    how many of you in this thread have "insisted" on her having to know an instrument

    it surprises me because(to give credit where credit is do)
    usually you guys give great advice,

    but I don't understand why SOME OF YOU continue trying to get rockchick26 to play an instrument ??

    as if that is really important to her,

    she's clearly said it's not important to her, and that she quickly "loses interest" in the amount of effort necessarily required

    it's not really important to what she wants to do

    she asked a great question:
    "why does she NEED to know how to play any instrument, to "break" into the music business""

    answer:
    she doesn't need to know that

    now because I studied and graduated at a major university music school,

    I'm a big "fan" of going to school,

    but only when it meets the persons NEEDS and Goals

    don't get me wrong, education is important and the more knowledge she has the more opportunities will likely present themselves

    but really its not necessary based on what she has said in this thread

    and even though she mentioned music lessons, she quickly mentioned after that really she doesn't think that will help her reach her goals

    shes already said she plays piano, and is happy with how she is progressing on that instrument

    what's the point of "instrument lessons/vocal lessons" as to meeting her goals ??

    she is "shy" and enjoys playing in the privacy of her own home

    just as importantly she's already stated multiple times in this thread, she doesn't enjoy piano enough to invest in music school for something like a performance degree

    Hi rockchick26,

    lets consider some occupations that fulfill what rockchick26 wants based on what she's said in this thread

    so you "like the excitement" of the concert scene

    then consider:

    maybe as a promoter ??

    maybe as an A&R representative ??

    maybe as some type of manager who manages multiple bands,

    that's just 3 that come to my mind right now, if you research there are others, etc

    I also thought the music journalist suggestion was excellent, and she has stated that is something she would like to do,

    my educated guess is that even though she is shy, the desire to be a "good" music journalist will "override" that,
    and her shyness will be overcome with the fact that she will be excited about the questions she would like to know so she can write a "good" review of whomever she is interviewing

    reality is that the music business is a business,

    and reality dictates that for rockchick26 it may take her awhile to build up enough contacts/networking to get the opportunities she wants,

    that's the great part about attending a technical school that teaches you about the business practices of the music industry, someplace like musicians institute

    you get an oppotunity to network/create contacts as you learn about the business,

    based on what you've said that is the ONLY type of schooling rockchick26 you might want to consider

    but you can certainly do what you want without attending some technical school,(it just may take you longer)

    you may also have to relocate if you aren't in an area that has an in demand music scene/city, or doesn't have the necessary opportunities you need to reach your goals

    I'm not saying you would have relocate, just that once again if you are not in an area that is a major music city, then it may take you longer to reach some of these goals

    so I would research some strategies and occupations that help you do what you will enjoy doing,

    I mentioned 3 of them, research those and others that meet your goals, and let us know how you want to proceed

    good luck !!
    Last edited by Schooligo; 07-02-2010 at 11:22 PM.
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  2. #17
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    Schooligo,
    I pretty much agree with you: I don't believe Rockchic's path should be that of a performer.

    However, you can sort of see why lots of people on here would jump straight into performing or playing an instrument. This is a music theory and performance forum after all!!
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  3. #18
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schooligo View Post
    so you "like the excitement" of the concert scene

    then consider:

    maybe as a promoter ??

    maybe as an A&R representative ??

    maybe as some type of manager who manages multiple bands,

    that's just 3 that come to my mind right now, if you research there are others, etc
    Hi Schooligo, and thanks for understanding!

    I actually have a book with all the jobs there are in music, and I had no problem finding some that I wanted to try, but when I read everything that is required and the type of personality it takes, I had to eliminate them. Same with the music journalism idea...I thought if I can't even hold a conversation when I'm meeting my favorite musicians, how will I be able to ask them questions in an interview? I am so shy and full of nervous anxiety that I rarely ever ask ANYONE questions, I usually only talk when someone asks me a question. I am starting to think my personality is ruining everything for me. In almost all of the examples I tried, feeling awkward was a major factor in why I quit. Are there even any people like this in the music business? Everyone seems to confident and cool and outgoing and crazy (in a good way), and I'm nothing like that.

    I know it sounds like I'm shooting down everyone's ideas, but this is stuff I've already been through with myself and I've shot these ideas down when I first started researching all this years ago. I am having trouble seeing myself managing a band or doing something that important because of my personality. I'm a follower, not a leader. I am the person in a group that you don't even notice because I'm not talkative or outgoing, and I don't stand out at all. This is probably my only problem, really.

    you may also have to relocate if you aren't in an area that has an in demand music scene/city, or doesn't have the necessary opportunities you need to reach your goals

    I'm not saying you would have relocate, just that once again if you are not in an area that is a major music city, then it may take you longer to reach some of these goals
    I live near Minneapolis/St.Paul so relocating would not be necessary. But I still love traveling (especially for concerts) so I dont want to live here forever anyway, at least not on a regular basis. I really want to live in an RV so I can travel anywhere I want anytime I want.

  4. #19
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    Quote Originally Posted by bluesking View Post
    Schooligo,
    I pretty much agree with you: I don't believe Rockchic's path should be that of a performer.

    However, you can sort of see why lots of people on here would jump straight into performing or playing an instrument. This is a music theory and performance forum after all!!
    Actually this is the "mental stuff" section, I purposely didn't post in the other sections because they were all about specific instruments.

    Maybe my post doesn't really belong anywhere on this site, but it was the only site I found for music career advice.

  5. #20
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    Quote Originally Posted by Schooligo View Post
    you ever see some of those psychology tests where the test subject keeps trying to jam a triangle shape in a round hole ?
    it doesn't work, no matter how hard you want it too,
    that the impression I get from SOME of You members here that have replied to her thread,
    how many of you in this thread have "insisted" on her having to know an instrument
    Sure Rockchick mentioned trying lots of things and said they didn't work. But ... sounds like too many "excuses" (easy), and not enough real solutions (hard).

    The only reason for "insisting" on playing an instrument, is ... that's the very heart of music, that's what it's all about. Really that's the only sure way in ... if you REALLY want to get in.

    Of course, it's true that if your heart is not fully into playing, then it's probably impossible (and I did say that before). And if someone is more interested in music journalism, then that's absolutely fine .... but it's the exact same answer - safest way with that is a degree in Music Journalism (then apply for every job going).

    But you know, it's just suggestions. For someone who expresses a desire to make music the absolute focus of their life, and looking for a way into that.

    Ian.

  6. #21
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockchick26 View Post
    Actually this is the "mental stuff" section, I purposely didn't post in the other sections because they were all about specific instruments.
    Maybe my post doesn't really belong anywhere on this site, but it was the only site I found for music career advice.
    I think your post is fine here. And although some ideas may not appeal to you, they are just suggestions ... the idea is that we are looking for a workable solution, right?

    It sounds to me like you should be less willing to take "No" for an answer, particularly in what you tried before re. playing piano and reading music etc. ... telling yourself you can't do it because you don't have the "natural ability" or whatever ... you just have to work very hard on it ...

    ... and same if the angle is music journalism rather than playing/composing, or same if it's music production or whatever ... best way with all these approaches is a serious academic course & qualification ... it may sound like hard work, but there's a reason for that (& it's the crucial reason).

    But only 2:cent's of course.

    Ian.

  7. #22
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    Yeah, maybe I'm just not disciplined enough to learn stuff on my own. As for going to school, I am flat broke and unemployed except for a few hours a week so there's no way I could afford school right now. And I don't see my personality changing anytime soon.

    At least I can keep on enjoying music, if nothing else!

    Thanks for trying to help me, everyone!

  8. #23
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockchick26 View Post
    Yeah, maybe I'm just not disciplined enough to learn stuff on my own. As for going to school, I am flat broke and unemployed except for a few hours a week so there's no way I could afford school right now. And I don't see my personality changing anytime soon.
    At least I can keep on enjoying music, if nothing else!
    Thanks for trying to help me, everyone!
    Well, yeah....OK. But like anything that's worth doing in life, you have to decide whether you really want to do it, .... or not.

    If you don't really want to do it, then that's perfectly fine. There are lot's of things I quite fancy doing, but I can't really be bothered to achieve those things.

    But if you decide that you really do want to achieve something (eg your dreams in music, or anything else), then there's just no alternative to doing whatever it takes ... eg no musician ever leant to play by giving up because it seemed too hard. Rafael Nadal & Roger Federer did not get to be the worlds best tennis players just by dreaming of winning Wimbledon ... what sort of effort do you think those guys put in?

    If you want to do it, then it's probably odd's-on that you can. You can. But the odds are a million-to-one-against for anyone who gives in when it seems tough.

    It's clear from your few posts here that you can write well (and many people can't, especially musical types), so the journalism route is clearly possible from that aspect.

    As for the lack of time and money - you have the same time as every other person on Earth (you have to decide how you want to use your time), and anyone can pay their way through higher education by part-time work ... sure that's a tough route, but those who really want to do it, WILL do it ... and in the end that's the difference.

    I'd encourage you to really go for it. You can do it. If you really want to. But that's the real question... do you actually want to?

    Ian.
    Last edited by Crossroads; 07-03-2010 at 10:57 AM.

  9. #24
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    Since it sounds like you're interested in the world of concerts and touring you might want to check out this book - lots of "real world", practical info on all aspects of the subject, written in an entertaining style.

  10. #25
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    Quote Originally Posted by Crossroads View Post
    Well, yeah....OK. But like anything that's worth doing in life, you have to decide whether you really want to do it, .... or not.

    If you don't really want to do it, then that's perfectly fine. There are lot's of things I quite fancy doing, but I can't really be bothered to achieve those things.

    But if you decide that you really do want to achieve something (eg your dreams in music, or anything else), then there's just no alternative to doing whatever it takes ... eg no musician ever leant to play by giving up because it seemed too hard. Rafael Nadal & Roger Federer did not get to be the worlds best tennis players just by dreaming of winning Wimbledon ... what sort of effort do you think those guys put in?

    If you want to do it, then it's probably odd's-on that you can. You can. But the odds are a million-to-one-against for anyone who gives in when it seems tough.

    It's clear from your few posts here that you can write well (and many people can't, especially musical types), so the journalism route is clearly possible from that aspect.

    As for the lack of time and money - you have the same time as every other person on Earth (you have to decide how you want to use your time), and anyone can pay their way through higher education by part-time work ... sure that's a tough route, but those who really want to do it, WILL do it ... and in the end that's the difference.

    I'd encourage you to really go for it. You can do it. If you really want to. But that's the real question... do you actually want to?

    Ian.
    Well I thought I wanted to, and I still feel like I do, I don't feel like I want to any less just because I don't have enough money for school. I know I have the same amount of time as anyone else, but I'm starting late in life (I'll be 38 next month), and if I wanted to start building a music career now, it would most likely take until my 50's to get really established enough to make a living from it. I just feel like it's already too late and if I can't do something NOW then the payoff will come when I'm too old to enjoy it anyway. How many 50 year old females do you see in the business?

    Thanks for the compliment on my writing, I do write a lot but when I tried my music website, it was only good for a few pages and then I was just repeating myself. I don't know how other journalists do it. There's only so many ways to describe music. I started to just rattle off facts in a very boring fashion. I'm much better at writing poetry, that's actually my strong suit. But, back to the music...

    I don't doubt for a second that music is the most important thing in my life, it's the only thing I was ever interested in from age 7 or 8 on. So to me it isn't a question of how badly I want it, but more of a question of what exactly do I want to do? I think the problem mostly lies in the fact that music is a tough business to get into and make a living in, and right now I'm on the verge of losing my apartment so I NEED a good paying full time job NOW or I'll be sleeping on people's couches (if I'm lucky). I guess survival has to come before music. If there was a touring company that hired people full time permanently for $10 an hour with no experience or degree required, I'd be on that in a New York minute. I know that sounds like the easy way out, but I don't want to be homeless and starving now for a chance to be working in music years from now. The payoff isn't guaranteed and taking the chance isn't worth the suffering in the meantime.

    I guess I just answered my own question, didn't I? Maybe all those times I "gave up" was because subconsciously I know it will be too much of a struggle to be worth it, because right now I need a solid secure job. If I was a millionaire, then I'd be a roadie for sure because I could live off that money and not have to worry about getting a real job!

  11. #26
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    Quote Originally Posted by walternewton View Post
    Since it sounds like you're interested in the world of concerts and touring you might want to check out this book - lots of "real world", practical info on all aspects of the subject, written in an entertaining style.
    Wow, this sounds really interesting!! I want to read it if for no other reason than to just learn what it's really like even if I didn't end up doing it. I mean I've seen countless interviews and tour documentaries with bands and I hear them talk about being on tour, but this book sounds like it's even more honest than that!

    One thing I'm afraid of, one of those reviews is by a female and she said the book is not geared towards females at all. But, I wanna check it out anyway. $20 isn't bad. Thanks for the link!

  12. #27
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockchick26 View Post
    I guess I just answered my own question, didn't I? Maybe all those times I "gave up" was because subconsciously ....
    Ha, ha ... well, Yes! And actually, that's the point.

    But the vital difference between those who do succeed in what they want vs. those who do not, is mostly that the ones who succeed insist on finding positive solutions, whereas those who don't succeed insist on finding 101 reasons why it can't be done.

    I never read autobiographies of famous people or books about famous life stories (I'm 100% disinterested in fame), but if I did, then I bet I could find dozens of books describing how people much older than you, with far more handicaps & much worse situations, achieved the most astounding things ...

    ... but none of us should feel intimidated by that ... we should feel encouraged to know that we can achieve things too ... if only we try (but that means, REALLY try).

    But what do I know .

    Ian.

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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockchick26 View Post
    Wow, this sounds really interesting!! I want to read it if for no other reason than to just learn what it's really like even if I didn't end up doing it. I mean I've seen countless interviews and tour documentaries with bands and I hear them talk about being on tour, but this book sounds like it's even more honest than that!

    One thing I'm afraid of, one of those reviews is by a female and she said the book is not geared towards females at all. But, I wanna check it out anyway. $20 isn't bad. Thanks for the link!
    You can get a good idea of what the book is about from the table of contents on Amazon.

    A lot of it is practical advice about the nitty gritty of touring profitably - sweating the details of the budget for the bus's gas and driver, radio/print/"street team" promotion, food and hotel costs, selling merch, dealing with promoters and club owners, etc - all the unglamorous hard work that goes on behind the scenes. I don't know how any of that is any less geared towards females than males...

    (There is, however, plenty of profanity, and some talk about sex, groupies, drugs, etc - maybe the one reviewer you mentioned found some of that stuff offputting.)

  14. #29
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    I did order that book! Like I said, if nothing else, it will be interesting just because I love anything that has to do with concerts/traveling/music, and I think it will help me in deciding what particular job I want to do.

    I am pretty bad at doing things, I always seem to find obstacles where other people don't see any. I suppose I should work on that bad habit!

    I want to add, I think I have figured out the exact job I want to do, or at least one that seems to be the easiest to obtain. Besides music, I am also really interested in cooking, becoming a personal chef, so I was thinking I could maybe be a personal chef for touring musicians? Does anyone know anything about how that works? Like does the chef tour with the band, on their bus, and cook the food right on the tourbus? This is another thing I could do out of my own RV, once I have one! God that would be a dream. Follow bands around on tour AND cook for them! Then in my spare time I could do the other things I love, take pictures, write, film videos/documentaries, all regarding music. I could be the world's first musician's personal chef/journalist/photographer/videographer! Let me know if this sounds too crazy!

  15. #30
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    Quote Originally Posted by Rockchick26 View Post
    Like does the chef tour with the band
    Maybe some acts at the highest levels (U2, Springsteen, etc) can afford their own traveling "personal chefs", but it sure isn't the way it works for your average working musician!

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