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Thread: Essential Songs for a Beginner

  1. #16
    Registered User ernzzz's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JNagarya
    music disappeared from the human experience between circa 1964 and Led Zeppelin.
    nahh

    ok grunje killed it a bit, but i think now we have everything pretty much mixed...
    in the same day you can listen to some great zeppelin remasters, or how the west was won, but also can listen some new ravi shankar, moby play, steve vai, rachmaninoff, or guthrie govan...

    there will be always ppl that is passionate for music, and they might express it in the most different fashions, it may have a bigger or smaller production, but all this adds to the palette of human (or personal) musical experience..
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  2. #17
    Banned JNagarya's Avatar
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    Had you been in your 20s when Led Zeppelin came on the scene, and you had been hearing music since earliest memories (the earliest #1 I recall is "Tennessee Waltz" by Patti Page), with no lapses or gaps, you'd understand what I'm getting at. For one, The Yardbirds were known and appreciated; Zeppelin was simply too close to them in time and sound and methods to impress as being something new; essentially, they increased the number of studio tricks, which The Yardbirds had already been doing, turned up the volume, and changed their name to Led Zeppelin.

    A friend of mine saw them live shortly after their first LP was issued, and Page played -- on stage -- a slow lick which was most impressive on the LP because played so fast. In other words, the impressive guitar work on the LP was largely studio tricks, not skill or talent.

    So some of us who went through all that are not impressed with The Yardbirds having increased the number of studio tricks, and increased the volume, then changed their name to "Led Zeppelin" as means to appear to be something "new". Want "heavy metal"? Listen to The Yardbirds. Or the early Kinks. Want "punk"? Listen to The Beatles backing Tony Sheridan, and on their first two LPS. And their early BBC material. Listen to the early Kinks.

    That's what I mean when I say that some act as if music began with Led Zeppelin. That is necessary, of course--that deliberate amnesia--because by blotting out The Beatles it gives Led Zeppelin a greater--fake--stature than they can be legitmately accorded. And then there's the ripping off of US blues artists--which they so pretended to idolize and respect--and taking the royalties for themselves.

    And the next generation ignores Led Zeppelin in order to accord a falsely elevated stature to such as Metallica and Guns & Roses. And, oh yeah, go back and grab the second-rate Black Sabbath, essentially because they indulged a negative paranoia.

    And actually assert the absurdity that Kiss contributed something other than sheer greed and gratuitous freakishness to titillate the kiddies.

    And "grunge," so-called, is a relabelling of "garage" -- with designer torn genes -- a disregard for the audience -- and no apparent interest in growth in artistry and musicianship. And "grunge" post-dates Led Zeppelin by at least 15 years, and so-called "punk" -- as in The Clash -- by at least as many years.

    There was a steady evolution in the quality and sophistication of rock 'n roll -- "rock" -- to and through The Beatles (and Bob Dylan; and, yes, The Beach Boys), thanks in significant part to Chuck Berry's literacy. (Chuck Berry was the original "guitar god," except we didn't call him that; and before Clapton it was Mike Bloomfield; and Clapton was eclipsed by Hendrix.) The Beatles absorbed all that, built on it, digested it into their own synthesis. And then such as The Clash come along and phonily jabber about "phony Beatlemania"--it wasn't phony--and reverse the growth, the progress made.

    Most of the "rock" music since The Beatles -- that classified as "punk" and "metal" and the like -- has been a defeatist's reaction into negativity and freakishness as substitute for creativity. War is the result of a failure of imagination; so is the mockery of the positive that is that disempowered indulgence in negativity.
    Last edited by JNagarya; 11-25-2007 at 05:10 PM.

  3. #18
    Modbod UKRuss's Avatar
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    It's been a while on this forum since I've read such a lot of rubbish in one post.


  4. #19
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    I.

  5. #20
    Registered User Obivion's Avatar
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    Is this guy for real?

    Seriously, all bands have influences. Deal with it.

    It doesn't make their music any less amazing...
    No one sings the blues quite like Yngwie!

  6. #21
    Banned JNagarya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by UKRuss
    It's been a while on this forum since I've read such a lot of rubbish in one post.

    God forbid we deal with the accurate history, eh?

    Or address the destructive results of the negativities, of which there were already more than enough in the world.

    But suit yourself; I'm obviously not for amnesia.

  7. #22
    Banned JNagarya's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Obivion
    Is this guy for real?
    Yes, I am for real. In particular, note that Led Zeppelin was sued, and finally admitted, that they claimed authorship -- and the royalties -- for a song written by a blues musician they claimed to respect and admire. That theft had to be conscious on their part.

    Seriously, all bands have influences. Deal with it.
    And all of the influences in the world, whether in music or not, are positive and constructive, therefore all, without exception, should not only be respected, and even defended, but also advocated and advanced? What's your favorite "hate core" band?

    It doesn't make their music any less amazing...[/QUOTE]

    But yer right: KISS's "music" was "amazing". And Fabian was spectacularly talented and fabulous, even though I prefer only-slightly-less-talented-and-fabulous Annette Funicello.

  8. #23
    Bedroom metalurgist LaughingSkull's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by JNagarya
    ... the destructive results of the negativities.
    This sounds like an appropriate title for some death metal suite, You have a metal heart don't you? Everything is just disguise ...

  9. #24
    Artistically Bankrupt
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    For Real

    *twitch
    Last edited by Blutwulf; 11-26-2007 at 02:08 PM. Reason: Whimsy
    "If a child learns which is jay and which is sparrow, he'll no longer see birds nor hear them sing."

  10. #25
    Bedroom metalurgist LaughingSkull's Avatar
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    Wellcome back, Jim. You were actually missed (by some).

  11. #26
    bitter old fool Jed's Avatar
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    Quote Originally Posted by Blutwulf
    JNagarya, I had (to the delight of millions) stopped posting and decided to merely lurk about, reading other peoples' posts. Unfortunately, your posts in this thread beg response. Although UKRuss' response is succinct, accurate, and unenigmatic, it lacks the garrulity befitting a response to one such as yourself.
    BLUTWULF in the house !!

    Welcome back to the vocal side of IBM (it's been too long that you've been silent)

    cheers,

  12. #27
    Bedroom metalurgist LaughingSkull's Avatar
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    I kind of like better Pat Metheny, than his influence Wes Mongomery. Should I feel guilt?

    Shall we go back to chords and scales .... as geeky as that may be ...

  13. #28
    Artistically Bankrupt
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    Hell, I wish now I hadn't deleted my post. JNagarya will only see the snippet in Jed's quote thingie, and miss out on the long-winded rebuttal.

    Like I said, I cannot really improve on UKRuss' post.

    JNagarya, if I had a nickle for everyone who holds all music in disdain which came out after they finished their mid-20's, I'd have enough for a new Lexus. To be blunt, as derivative as you find the 70's, 80's and 90's, so too were the 40's, 50's, and 60's. Even the iconic Beatles were no stranger to "deliberately embracing influence."*

    If you are so repulsed by the ongoing march of derivation, then surely you while away the hours listening to recordings of "Gronk and the Neanderthals" beating upon rocks? Perhaps your favorites include "Egyptian Dude Who Found out He Can Blow Through a Reed?" Blowing Reeds is surely all the rage in your home...


    *Ripping off others
    "If a child learns which is jay and which is sparrow, he'll no longer see birds nor hear them sing."

  14. #29
    Modbod UKRuss's Avatar
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    You're getting a new Lexus?

    Lovely cars.

  15. #30
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    Hi Blut … nice too see you around again … shame I missed you’re deleted post…but I get the general idea LoL!

    Ian.

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